Phorest FM Episode 305: Keya Neal on the Power Authenticity Holds for Growth & Fulfilment

Episode Transcript

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Finish this sentence – At my deepest core, I am.

Keya Neal, Guest: At peace.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Okay, being misunderstood, a blessing or?

Keya Neal, Guest: An opportunity.

Alex Bélisle-Springer: Keya hi, I’m so honored to record the first podcast of Season 9 with you here in January. It’s so good to see you. How are you doing?

Keya Neal, Guest: I am well. Thank you, Alex, for having me and it’s such an honor and you know what it’s really awesome to be like the first of 2025. You kind of get to set the tone a little bit and kick it off.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: So that’s an honor and a pleasure, yeah, and you do get to set the tone and I know that you are someone who speaks from the heart and you’re not afraid to, you know, say exactly how you feel, and I love that, and so I’m very excited for today. Um, authenticity actually is something that you said in our call when we were trying to schedule when we would do this recording. You said you were coming back to that again and again over the past few months. Why is that?

Keya Neal, Guest: You know. So, first of all, you know that word had been lingering with me, like you said, that you know the majority of the year, and it was because I was getting some challenge and pushback about things that I find to be so dear to my heart. You know the things that make me me, the way my body is made up. You know I’ve always been that person to stand on my own truths. Right, I think something, I feel something in my body and that’s just what it is. And when you get pushback and resistance from people you know, and you get that nudge to have to change and evolve to suit others, to maintain their sense of peace or to not challenge their comfort, it becomes a shaky ground. Because you know we want to be in these spaces, you want to elevate, you want to move, you want to advance and grow. But sometimes the exchange and the currency can be your authenticity and I’ve just simply fought with that for so long because I’ve had to endure, like I said, the opposite, because I can’t abandon that. I just can’t.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Would you say you’ve struggled with that, like, did you pay the price of that exchange? Like in 2024, would you say absolutely that?

Keya Neal, Guest: I mean specifically not only just, you know, pay the price in a mental or emotional way, but in a very physical, a very public and a very financial way, which is, you know, which was hard. You know, 2024 did deliver on some hardships, and that was one of them was where my, my authenticity was being, was being, uh, up for grabs, you know, where people wanted me to be something that I wasn’t, and I couldn’t abandon that mission in my heart. And so it costs me. It costs me spaces in the industry, it costs me relationships, it costs me opportunities and I, you know so I saw more of that in 2024, but I think that was less about me and more about people being more authentic to who they really were and now realizing that they weren’t necessarily all the way aligned with me.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: So now we were all right, there’s a little class there.

Keya Neal, Guest: I had not changed. I think you know, when your environment changes, then the relationship change. You know changes. So I think that’s more what it was, and so we saw that play itself out from the end of 23 to the end of 24. We saw it exasperate and be just more of the same.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: How do you define authenticity to you?

Keya Neal, Guest: Authenticity to me is acknowledging what you feel to be your truth, right.

And truth is subjective to facts, because your truth is really only your list of facts that you found to be true to you.

Whatever you experienced, however you felt it, however you saw it, however you viewed it, this is you know, this is what your, your truth is, and so my truth and authenticity says this is how I’ve experienced it, this is how I’m going to share it, this is what I’m going to say, and I’m going to always be true to that and not give in to the pull to be something that I’m not, or believe something that I’m not, or, uh, sort of suppress exactly who I am and what I know to be my truth as I know it, see it and experience it. So I think authenticity is leaning into the pain points or the truth or the beautiful parts of you, whatever, whatever that is, but being acutely aware of what that is and not allowing outside forces to change that and make you think differently or make you think that they’re not valid because they are yours.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Is it more like to you specifically? Is it more to do with like all the different parts of our, of your identity, for example, or is it more to do with the values you know to hold?

Keya Neal, Guest: All of it. So let me tell you this about me. Ever since I was a child I was a, I was, I had a lot to say. I always wanted to ask a lot of questions. I was very curious as a child and sometimes that just didn’t work for me. You know curious children you know I grew up with. You know children stay in. You know you were just curious and sometimes and I developed over the years like a very you know a clear understanding of how I felt on every subject I was never at a loss of words to express that. You know, all growing up, whether it was accepted or not, yeah.

That’s who I was. So, yes, it is your character, it is. You know, who you are as a person is how you function, but it’s also your values in your systems and, like I said, your, your beliefs for your whole self and being able to stand strong in that no matter what. So I’m very and here’s how I see, here’s how God works, because he’s my son, is like that. He’s 14 and he’s got all the mouth in the world and I’m like, listen to me, this isn’t going to work for you right now. This is going to work against you ridiculously, but it will be something you’ll be able to do if you learn how to manage it. This will work for you later on.

So I think, for me, I’ve always been a truth seeker, I’ve always been a truth teller and I stand strong in what it is, for me, right. And so sometimes people can’t take that. Sometimes, if the truth does not align with how they feel about something, there’s a lot of rejection. But I’ve learned over the years how to have great conversations with people when we don’t agree, but sometimes people who don’t agree don’t know how to have great conversations with me.

They view me as you know the ops.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Right yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: And so there’s that, that, that rejection, and, unfortunately, a lot of what we’ve seen since 2020 is built around the racial climate in our country and it’s it’s come to the forefront and has been a huge part of a conversation that I’ve been thrust into, and so it’s just kind of been it’s been a little, it’s been a little bit of a ride, alex.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, I can imagine. I have a lot of compassion for you for that. Honestly, I can only imagine the toll it takes on all spheres of your life. You know, emotionally, physically, it’s draining.

Keya Neal, Guest: It’s not one or the other, it’s all of it.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, exactly.

Keya Neal, Guest: It’s how you feel it and how your body interprets it. It’s the mental, it’s the physical, it’s the spiritual, it’s the spiritual, it’s, uh, it’s, it’s all the things, because, no, there’s no one realm when you’re in it. It’s, it’s all of it. It’s who you are. What you feel, see, touch, what you experience, what you share, what you are vulnerable to is the sum of who you are in totality.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: That’s the authentic part, is knowing that and acknowledging that and just accepting that. Authenticity has to be first accepted from you before anybody else.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, facts. When did you start accepting all the parts of you?

Keya Neal, Guest: Believe it or not, it wasn’t that long ago.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I can believe it.

Keya Neal, Guest: It’s hard because there’s an ebb and flow, right. Like I said, I’ve always been a true seeker. I’ve always been, you know, inquisitive. I’ve always, like I said, been very aware about how I feel about things, and I’m never at a loss for words, like I said. So I’m always really clear. My communication is like a thousand, and not everybody likes that, especially if they can’t return the favor.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Let me just say that.

Keya Neal, Guest: So sometimes in my life, in different parts of my career, that’s worked for me and sometimes it hasn’t. And I was telling someone a story recently that I remember that when I was a child it was like don’t say anything. Then I became a mouthy teenager. Then it was okay, you’re mouthy, you’re smart and all. Then it was okay, well, wouldn’t I become a mouthy teenager. Then it was okay, you’re, you’re mouthy, you’re smart, knob. Then it was okay, well then I’ll be a quieter, um, new adult. And then I became a business owner where I had to learn how to speak up for myself and be able to be a business owner, aim for the week. You know what I’m saying. An entrepreneur will grow you up quicker than any birthday can.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: You hear me.

Keya Neal, Guest: Then I became an entrepreneur and then that was another phase. And then I started another, another part of my life where I remember shutting down for the last time as an adult when someone shared with me that they didn’t think that my contribution was valuable and they wished I would just shut up. And this was a boss and he said I just wish you would shut. And he didn’t say it that nicely, and um, I remember just being quiet.

Everything they asked me was I’m just glad to be here, I just had no contribution whatsoever.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: It pains me so much to hear that, because I was prepping for this conversation and I was looking through. I often take notes about a bunch of different stuff when I’m watching movies. You know all the like, the script, the dialogues and stuff, and, if you might allow, what you just said there reminded me I don’t know if you watched um, the, the recent movie by um Zoe Kravitz, uh, in which what’s it called Blinkink Twice.

Keya Neal, Guest: No, but tell me.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Okay. So Blink Twice came out sometime in the fall, I believe, last year, and it’s a very, very intense, in a way, movie. A lot of parallels have been drawn between everything that’s happened with Jeffrey Epstein and everything that’s happening with P Diddy as well, and anyway. So, beyond the point, I was watching this coming back from or going to Dublin. I was on the plane and I was like I’m writing notes about this movie, yeah, literally, and one of the first note that I took was, like part of the dialogue where this um and it’s a very, very beginning of the movie um, this guy who’s, I guess, managing the waiters for this like reception night, says to one of the uh, one of the waiters um, last year you were quite, and he like pauses chatty, try to be more invisible this time. And the character who’s who he’s telling this to is a black woman and I feel like that is so representative of our society we don’t get room to be our authentic self and because that rhetoric has been accepted all of our lives.

Keya Neal, Guest: When you, you know, when a woman tries to a black woman specifically, uh, tries to get into spaces not getting exist in spaces, whether it’s your job, you know whatever it is right, when you get into these spaces and you exist, you have to understand that most black women have multiple personalities of multiple lives.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, the code switching.

Keya Neal, Guest: They won’t know, you don’t really know the black woman that you’re working with, right, we’re kind of coming around now to just kind of saying this is just what it is, but for the sake of again, we can’t be as authentic as we would like because we know that that is not the place, it won’t be accepted, it wouldn’t be. Um, they’re not going to foster that life, right, that part of you I’m that’s, I guess I’m trying to say so. Yes, it’s like I don’t want you to be so chatty, I want you to be more invisible. I want you to suppress those parts of you. I mean, I’ve experienced that a couple of times, even working in a new salon.

They were like, stop talking to people. I’m like I’m saying good morning and they’re like, yeah, but that client don’t talk to their client, don’t talk to people, just do what you’re here to do and kind of keep it moving. And that’s a hard space to navigate. It’s a hard space to navigate. It’s a hard space to navigate out of, because we navigate that space flawlessly. I do want to say that’s in our DNA to code switch. We already know we can’t bring our full selves to certain environments, but I think when you start embracing your authenticity and accepting who you are and how you exist and how you show up, the more you are likely to bring more of that into the forefront without having to code switch. And so it is.

There are a lot of moments where we’re being asked to shift. It’s like you take a job, and here’s what was funny about 20. You get it. You get partnerships and jobs where people will say I want you because I want you, but I want you, but I don’t want you. I want you to be. I want you to be black and have your experiences, but don’t be too black. I want you to share your experience, but don’t make me feel too bad. I want you to. I want you to help me and guide me to make the right decisions, but, no, I might not take your advice. I want you to do what I want you to do and execute whatever this deliverable is, but do it the way that we can understand it, the best that we can, the way we do it this way. So it’s like you’re constantly putting a square peg in a round hole or vice versa, and we’re constantly having to evolve ourselves to fit whatever it is we’re trying to fit into. And sometimes when I don’t want to even say get in trouble where I command the respect for me, I’ll stop it in a heartbeat and go.

Keya Neal, Guest: If you knew about this already, we wouldn’t be here. If you knew how to do this texture hair video, you wouldn’t. Don’t. Don’t give me the time frames of everything else that you’ve done. This is new to you. It’s not new to me. So let me lead either. Either you want me to lead or I’m not. You know, when people ask me, they’ll pay you for advice that they’re not even going to take. That was a hard pill to swallow. So, like I said a lot of times, you know what black women don’t speak about is all the ways we have to shift and move to get in the fit in, even even in dei, like okay, yeah, before that conversation, but you bring me in to be black, but don’t be too black.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: Don’t be too harsh. Don’t be too truthful. Don’t make me feel too bad. Don’t say the honest truth, don’t make us, you know, reject. Don’t say it too loud. Don’t put too much emphasis on the T? The A was too hard. Did you hear that D at the end? She the t, the a was too hard. Did you hear that d on the end? She said it was too tough. You know it’s like you, it’s, it’s a lot and I think we’re just exhausted with it now at this point.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: So it’s like I mean, how could you not?

Keya Neal, Guest: it’s like you’re living a life under scrutiny at all times.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, yeah, you are, and everybody does what they want to do until yeah everybody loves you until and everybody has an until, it’s whatever that is, that you’re not willing to sacrifice.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I want people to like I’m pausing like a little pregnant pause here, because I want people to like to go back, if anything, and re-listen to that, because I think that is like so, so important. Also, just recently in December I attended a personal essay workshop and it was really, really interesting. It’s not something that I do necessarily. It’s something that I want to get into a bit more, but at some point the person who was teaching the class said there’s a lot of space for rumination when you’re in transition, and I guess I wonder about how or what you perhaps have ruminated on in spaces of transition, like either whether that’s like in your personal life or career, or even in between, like code switching what do you? What does your brain go to? And like ruminating over.

Keya Neal, Guest: That’s a good question. I’m gonna be honest. I think that I’m always drawn to making a decision of whether I want to be in that space or not. What is the biggest highlight? Do I want to make an impact? Do I want to make some level of impact? Am I willing to adjust, not switch, but am I willing to adjust to make the impact needed? And is it going to matter if I do it at that moment, if I make that adjustment, whatever? That is so like when you’re constantly in those transitions and you’re just you’re always having to decide and you’re always having to create this space where you have to make quick decisions of saying is this worth it or not?

And you’re negotiating with yourself. Yeah, you’re negotiating with yourself. At all times You’re negotiating with yourself, and that’s a terrible place to be, to have to negotiate between your humanity and your livelihood.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: It really is.

Keya Neal, Guest: Really.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Through what emotion do you understand yourself first? Do you understand yourself first? Do you understand yourself through grief, through joy, through I don’t know pain?

Keya Neal, Guest: Something else. I love that question and I think it’s all of the above. I allow myself to feel everything, whatever it is that I’m feeling, my grief, my grief comes out in certain ways my joy I’m specific about finding my joy and creating my joy or tapping into what brings me joy but I allow myself to feel all the things all the time and I give them room to breathe, and then I I I kind of just move on from that, like I, I have to give myself space to feel it, like you ever, you ever had that friend. That goes I’m not gonna let you be sad today like, yeah, but I want to be sad today.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I’m like you. I’m like, I want to be. I want to feel this, I want to be sad for a minute.

Keya Neal, Guest: I don’t, because we have different people for different things in our lives. So sometimes I have a friend that won’t let me be sad. I have a friend that will let me be sad and be there with me for a minute. I have a friend that will help me navigate. You know how to find the silver lining in some things. Maybe they will, you know, help me talk through it to get to my next, my next level. And then some people like, well, who are we beating up? Who are we beating up today? Who’s upset you? You know we have different friends for different things.

And so I do surround myself with people that support me in all my ways of working through, but a lot of times I’ve just learned to give room and breathe to every emotion, however I’m experiencing, whatever it is, and then I’m able to to pick myself up and say, okay, well, that was that moment, let’s move on.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: That’s really powerful. How do you like? What specifically do you do to create that space?

Keya Neal, Guest: I guess okay, so let’s just let me, let me just give so joy. I love joyous moments, I love finding those pockets in those, those moments, and I, I, I am very specific about creating whatever that is right, I love to, but I don’t love to cook Fair enough so it’s not going to be getting in the kitchen, it’s going to be fine, but it is going to be after I finish, if I do get in the kitchen.

Keya Neal, Guest: But holding space for grief looks like to me, allowing myself to be in the bed and sort of isolate a little bit with my thoughts Sometimes. I love music and sleeping. I don’t think we give enough credit to nap, naps. Naps are the key, naps and rest. Yes, go to bed early, but naps are like those stolen, treasured moments that you don’t appreciate until you’re older. You might have a chance, but I’m telling you naps are the jam, because naps are that. Naps are like that extra love that you give your body and your mind when it’s time to rest. And for me, when I take a nap, it’s like my body is working to rejuvenate itself and when I wake up I feel much more refreshed and clear about what it is that I’m trying to process anyway.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: So a lot of times I have done this thing where I’ll share this with you. I do this thing where I’ll go on a staycation. I’m getting ready to go on one now and I will get a room somewhere. It doesn’t have to be far away from home, it could be down the street and I will get a room that maybe has a spa area or just whatever. And I take all of my notes, I take my books, I take my computer, I take everything. But I watch dumb TV, trash, tv, soft trash. I can’t do any more. Real drama Got to be stuff like the Young and the restless, like stuff.

That’s not real you know, I will maybe do a spa, but I’ll take naps, I’ll think, I’ll write, I’ll get it all out, and once I get everything out of my mind and whatever that process is I’m able to actually disconnect and rest.

And during those restful periods of my naps in the middle of the day, early nights, I find that what I’m thinking about it becomes more clear, what my next moves become obvious, and it’s just like you allow God time to download the things that you need to know but no one can hear if there’s a lot of clutter going on, if there’s like cowbells ringing in your ear that’s how I feel sometimes, like there’s so much noise.

So to really check out, it’s going to a hotel by myself for two or three days and just doing whatever it is I want to do to get it all out, whether that’s singing and dancing, listening to a bunch of loud music, reading a book knowing I’m not going to read but two or three pages before I fall asleep, no problem, I do all and I give in to whatever those impulses are until I completely run out of gas. And then when I go to sleep, I can wake up and plan an entire year. I can plan two quarters at least of whatever and have clear vision about everything, because I’ve given my brain the permission to rest. And so doing that in smaller increments, maybe not that full explosion, but smaller moments where I say I’m a.

I used to always say I’m gonna go to sleep on it . Like, instead of being upset, I’m like I’m just gonna go take a nap, because things do tend to look a lot clearer and different after a nap. These kindergartners don’t know what they got going. They don’t understand.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, they’ve got the good life, the naps.

Keya Neal, Guest: Somebody make me take a nap and cut the light off and then force me to go to bed and let me qualify for a nap. Nap napping is not getting in the bed. Your body doesn’t interpret the naps the same when you get in, but you have to lay across the bed or on the couch or something.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: It’s across the bed. Across the bed. I’ve never done that.

Keya Neal, Guest: Across the bed is different because it feels stolen. It feels extra. It tells you it’s extra, it doesn’t. Your body doesn’t think it’s nighttime. So lay across the bed and not in the bed. Maybe throw something on you, it just feels different.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I will, I will. I’m a big ask. Anyone in my close circle? I am a huge fan of napping, probably the one that naps the most in my group of friends.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: But before I do that I have one last question, specifically around authenticity and who you are. Authenticity is an orientation, not a destination. Live as many lives, each one as true as the last. How many lives have you lived?

Keya Neal, Guest: You know I love that, so let me count them up for you. One, two, three, five.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Five.

Keya Neal, Guest: I can qualify. I know exactly when things changed and shifted for me at least five times.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Wow.

Keya Neal, Guest: Mm-hmm, and I thought about this. It’s funny that you asked me that question. I thought about that a couple weeks ago and I was like I think I’m on my fifth life, where things are completely different. I might even I think I’m still in my fifth life, like it feels different and it’s evolving, but I still feel like it’s my fifth, it’s my fifth realm, like I feel like what you did as a child is like that first life, right, and yeah, literally, I was talking about this yesterday. I said you, you make your bed in your 20s, right, you do. You wreak all the havoc on your life in your 20s. This is separate. This is not my life, but this is how I feel. Like we, you know, live it kind of at the surface. Like 20s, you mess everything up, your 30s, you fix everything up, your 40s, you’re trying to stay steady and trying to now create the life, right, you’re trying now you’re saying you’re, you’re for what you want to live in your fifties.

Your fifties are kind of like the explosion, to really walk out what you, what you built in your forties. You know your fifties and in your sixties you live off of that. You’re in your seventies. You’re just like hands, completely off, like seventies.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: You should be like oh, that’s my age, but me, I’ve.

Keya Neal, Guest: I’ve evolved a lot in my life and being different from people you know not just my childhood, but being a young, a young woman that understood that I had some deficiencies there too. You know as far as you know my personality or my character, or even what I experienced. You know, then it was being a young mother slash entrepreneur. That was a whole other.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Both at the same time, yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: And so like they feel like two different lives, like that young, that young teenager-y to mid. And then there was the young mother type, you know, and I wasn’t excessively young, I was in my twenties, but I was also trying to build an empire at the same time, and that is where I knew I was sitting on a rocket, like I was in willingly to getting on it. Apparently, those two kind of did. And then I, then I, another life for myself, you know, being the educator, guest artist, platform artist, you know, building, building. They’re kind of fusing together too, just a little bit like this whole next level of, you know, conversation and movement it’s directly related to the entrepreneurial space.

You know that I’ve been in, but it still feels differently.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: It feels different for me. Which one of these lives, I feel, or I’m curious, and they might have all in different ways, impacted you the most or have been transformative, but I I wonder if there’s one that really stood out to you as being, like, the most transformative, I guess in in the way of like you know, you’ve you’ve really got to understand who you were to your deepest core, kind of thing.

Keya Neal, Guest: You know what? You’re absolutely right. When there was a moment in my life where I didn’t understand why God had allowed me to experience so many different things that didn’t seem relevant to the other, I felt like I had a lot of puzzle pieces and I was like well, what did I do that for and why was this time spent doing this and why did I work this job? Or why was I in a relationship with this people or this group or this, you know whatever? And I didn’t understand how it all was going to play out. Until one moment I woke up and it was like God showed me everything and it cleared up like a pixel screen. Like I was looking at a big TV, like that was fuzzy and grainy, and all of a sudden it just cleared up like a pixel screen. And God goes. See, because remember when you did this, remember that little stint in college, remember when you, you know, you were a journalist and now you’re going to write, and then you did this and you were an entrepreneur, and then you did this particular, you know, to this school, with these people, to learn to embed that seed that would now bloom over here like this relationship and this education or this experience will.

You will see the fruit of that over here and and at some point I was like I get it.

I get it and I leaned into something one of my pastors had said. He said you know, we spend a lot of time, you know, with the puzzle pieces of our life, trying to hide certain pieces and kick them on the ground and put it underneath the table. And he’s like cause you don’t want nobody to see the ugly parts or the parts that you thought were failure, failures, and you know. And he said but every part of your life matters, the good, the ugly, the bad, the indifferent, whether you understood it or not, all of it matters and you need every single piece to complete the picture. And that stuck with me because I now understand what my complete picture looks like. Like that picture may evolve in itself, but I definitely trust the process more now, knowing that everything that I experienced, even if I don’t understand it exactly right now, I will understand it better by and by, and at another time it will show itself for what it, what its purpose was, because everything has a purpose. Yeah, every negative there’s a positive, doesn’t matter.

So even what I feel like I went through in 24, I’m going to see it, even if not exactly in 25, I’m sure I’m going to see like, oh, I had to go through that. This needed to happen. This, you know, it wasn’t a failing, it was a part of the process, it’s a part of my journey, and so now I forgive myself quicker. You know I forgive things quicker, I get over things quicker, I move through things quicker, because now I can say this I’ll see why this happened later, and that’s what I pray for, like show me what this is going to do later, cause I don’t understand why I had to do this. Why do I have to go through this? Show me now, show me you know, make sure my eyes are open so I can understand and accept why this, why this happened. But the acceptance comes in the moment, not later. You get me.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, I do, and it sounds like your kids don’t do something, and then they don’t understand it right then. But they got to do it, they got to, they got to understand, they got to listen to you right then, and then later they’ll understand. So that’s kind of how I feel, like we were working it out, and sometimes you waste time trying to understand it exactly right then, and then you’re frustrated because you don’t, but that’s because you can’t see the future. Now. For me, I feel like trust and belief is two huge things that also have to be aligned with your authenticity. Trusting that, no matter what, it’s all going to work out for the good. And, like you said, I may not have a complete understanding of the why for everything, but I know there’s purpose behind everything.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, and being able to forgive yourself really quickly is power to you. It sounds very, very healing.

Keya Neal, Guest: It’s not easy to get to because a lot of us live in regret. You know we beat ourselves up about decisions that we made and things that go what if I had done a different? What if I didn’t say that? What if I didn’t do that? What if I didn’t? What if, what if, what if? And my thing is okay, but I did. And you know what? There’s no wrong answer. It’s just whichever choice you made, there’s no wrong choice. I tell my kids all the time. There’s no wrong choice. It’s just whichever one you choose is the one you got to walk out and you make the best out of that.

So I try. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not sitting here saying I don’t get angry or that I don’t go through that, but I try to submit to my process of saying, okay, so you did that. Can you stand on that? Do you regret doing it? Or you just don’t like the results? Maybe I didn’t like the results, but if I could do it again, I probably would. Like, there’s not very much that I do in my life that I have to apologize for or live in regret of saying I wouldn’t do it again. I may not like how it happened or how it was interpreted or how you know what the result was. But when you get to a point of knowing who you are, this is where your authenticity lives. When you know who you are and you’re true to that, you lessen the likelihood of living a regretful life because you now know.

Well, that’s just, that was from my heart, and I’m okay with that. I left that relationship because that’s what my heart says, that I deserve more. And you can’t, you know, whatever it is, but it’s it’s. It’s really a process, but I’m, I’m well, I’m a woman of a certain age. You know, I’m in my 50s now, so I’ve had to learn a lot about forgiving myself for things that I would deem as mistakes or out of order processes. Sometimes, you know, when that happens, if you accept, that it has purpose.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Early enough, you can relieve yourself of the regret. I absolutely love that and I really like it and I keep coming. The word that keeps on being like I’m a very visual person in my head, Like I see like words coming to me and like that word right now is like healing. I feel like we need to tap into that a little bit. For some people, healing is coming back to the coming home, I guess, to the truth of who you are. How do you define healing and what’s your framework of healing?

Keya Neal, Guest: I guess you know, I don’t know if it’s if healing is coming back to who you were because sometimes healing means accepting who you are now.

I’ll give you an example. I broke my ankle at 23, tragically, and I was like the time of my life. It sat me down for months and I couldn’t evolve out of that fracture. I mean, it wasn’t even a fracture, it was a total, reconstructive type measured thing and, like I said, I’m a woman of a certain age, so my recovery wasn’t as easy as they had documented, I think for someone else. I don’t know who they were thinking about when they said that, but that timeline was not mine. I couldn’t understand. I kept calling them, “When are we going to button this up? So what is it? Okay, I get the surgery, I get in the boot. Don’t be in my shoes, I’m going to walk, do a little therapy.

So when do y’all think we were going to wrap this up? And she was like oh baby, no, she was like no, this is going to be like a year, year and a half. And I was like shut your mouth. I was like there’s no way I’m going to be dealing with this. And she says oh, yeah, she says you’re not going to fully listen to the words she said. You’re not gonna fully come to who you will be until about a year, year and a half. You’ve got a year or so to evolve into what it will be, because it will never be what it was, because you’ve now had this accident.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Big lesson there.

Keya Neal, Guest: So healing doesn’t always mean defaulting back to something. It’s accepting where you are and who you are and how you’re showing up at that moment. Who am I now? I am a person with a recovered, fractured ankle. That means I have to make room for an ankle that does not look or respond or operate the way it did in July, the day before that accident.

I’m not that same person. My ankle is not the same. I can’t change that. But I did heal. I’m healed, but I’ve healed into something else. I’m healed, I have another mold, I have another mechanic, a different set of mechanics about me. So now I have to heal and accept that healing and acceptance are two things that have to work in tandem with each other.

It’s not just healing to never know that it’s there. You’re going to heal and have a scar too. You’re going to be reminded. There might be some residual pain there, and then you might have to make adjustments for that and realize that there might be some triggers that you know. So it’s a whole thing around healing. But you know who’s in control of that? Mostly you. You are, yeah, yeah, when it’s snowing out, because I’m reminded that I’ve got this, this fracture. I’m reminded, you know, like the little old lady that’s going to rain a day, with some with some high heels on for about 2.2 and a half, for about 30 minutes, and then you’re gonna see me in some sneakers and you know what. You’re gonna accept me because I’m different.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Nothing wrong with sneakers also.

Keya Neal, Guest: Oh honey, I’ve, honey. I’ve been here, me and me. Covid started me with being a sneakerhead, but the ankle break really solidified, like me and my kids fight over my shoes.

I’m so glad my 14 year old does not wear my size anymore because no shoe was safe with him. His foot would not grow out of that size and I was like hurry up, because you’re killing me. So, yeah, so, but yeah, like I said, evolution, I accept exactly who I am and how I am and I just make that a part of my process going forward. Is that now I am who I am today? Yeah, and I’m responsible for those triggers and knowing that there are the triggers out there, but I’m responsible for how I respond to them and how I prepare for it, and you know all the things.

Whether it’s an ankle break or a heartbreak, it’s kind of all the same.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: That’s true. I love that perspective. Thank you for sharing that. You’re welcome. I want to bring us back to, or like have a tie-in to, the hair and beauty industry and the role, the very different roles, that you have within the industry. Before we close off, I guess I asked this question to the last guest who was on the show in 2024. I’m very curious to hear your response to it. What about being a founder or, I guess, what belief about being a founder in this industry did you hold on to early on but have since let go?

Keya Neal, Guest: That I had to fit in, that I had to be what was already trending, that I had to mimic what was already there, and I found that the biggest hack to being a founder is finding and like literally clinging on to what makes you different. That’s it. There’s nothing else to say. If you didn’t get it. Listen to that again.

That I had to fit in, that I had to be what was already trending, that I had to mimic what was already there, and I found that the biggest hack to being a founder is finding and like, literally clinging on to what makes you different. That’s it, there’s, there’s. There’s nothing else to say. If you didn’t get it. Re-listen to that again, to what makes you different, run towards what makes you different. Conquer what scares you the most. Like, run towards it. Do you, literally do you.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Once I realized.

Keya Neal, Guest: You know I’ve been so rebellious all my life, like I hated social media and everybody goes. It has to have an aesthetic and you got to post so much and it’s got to look this way and all the colors, and I was like forget your algorithm. I didn’t even say it that nicely. You’re going to get what I give, whatever that is. Whether I want to talk about my kids, food, the salon, hair, if I tell them a joke, whatever it is that I’m doing, you’re going to get me because I’m multifaceted, so you’re going to get a multifaceted page and if you’re following me, then know that’s what you’re gonna get. That ain’t what you want. Go follow somebody else and all I did was.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Take what was true to me and amplify that. Spotlight that. And like, this would be my last question for the episode, but I’m curious to hear about the way, the ways you’ve noticed moving from from your center, I guess, has changed or impacted the, I guess, the results or like the opportunities and such that you’ve had in the industry, like was there a before and after from when you’ve really started to like, embrace, doing you?

Keya Neal, Guest: No, I have not been the change. I’ve been me for a long time. I’ve been me for a long time. I’ve been me for a long time. If anyone ever wanted to do some work on some, some work to, to, to, you know, deep dive into Kia, you will see that I’ve had the same conversations, the same consistency of it, the same thing all the way through. I can honestly say that I’ve made it. I’ve become popular for being who I am. But hear me when I say people love who you are until who you are challenges who they are. We can put a period right there.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: People don’t mind you doing you until you somehow interrupt them.

Doing them interrupts them doing them. So what has happened in 24 really isn’t a reflection of me in any regard. What I’m saying is our climate has changed.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah.

Keya Neal, Guest: So the climate has given room for people to be their authentic self and share what they really feel and think. And now, because it wasn’t that they didn’t exist before. Okay, if anybody wants to know what I’m talking about, you can go on my page. I’ve pinned everything relevant to me over the past artistically, but what I will say is that you can. You can say things, speak to things, do you until someone decides they don’t like it anymore. But that’s not on you, that’s on them.

And so I think it wasn’t that people weren’t who they were, it’s just that they were silent because for a minute in 20, and I’m just gonna, because I know we’re talking about you know, even on panels and things that we will do we’re talking about diversity and inclusion and the belonging and all of that together. And so I think there were people who were not for that, regardless. They just were made to feel like the minority in their thinking and they were ashamed to say differently, so they suppressed their feelings, right, now so they.

They’ve suppressed their feelings. But when they became more empowered and they became they, they started getting permission to speak up and speak out. I think it just was an indication that oh, and, by the way, I don’t have to listen to this anymore, I don’t have to accept what you say anymore. I’m just going to put my fingers in my ear and I’m actually going to tell you I’m not listening to you and I don’t want to hear that anymore. And that’s okay, because I was never talking to you anyway. I wasn’t talking to you anyway. You know XYZ and I’m like but I haven’t changed, you just have changed it. Sometimes we got to remember that too. That’s not everybody’s story, but that was my story. You asked me, yeah, was there before not to know? I wasn’t. The before, before and after I think we’re before and after consciousness. Before and after the sudden, the sudden of now. We want to be diverse and inclusive in our country and we weren’t. We weren’t ready for that type of change.

And we tried to, like a good friend of mine said, we tried to eat the elephant all at once and everybody started to choke. So those that were not in the, in the space where they could really process that the way they, you know, could have, I guess, going forward or there were options. They choked and now they’re spitting it out and they’re regurgitating it and it’s like flying across the room and it’s a mess. But I haven’t changed, I really haven’t. Whoever, whoever this fifth life is, that fifth life person has been the fifth life person. I hadn’t changed one bit.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I love this. I’m obsessed with everything that we’ve talked about. You’ve been so, so generous with your insights and just the stories you’ve shared as well. Thank you so much.

Keya Neal, Guest: You’re welcome. I appreciate you having me on such insightful questions. I haven’t had this conversation in a minute like not like this, like these questions were really profound. I loved it, thank you. Thank you for being so thoughtful and not just asking surface things, you know, so I can have a chance to dig deep.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I appreciate that. I put a lot of thought into it, for sure.

Keya Neal, Guest: You did and it shows.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I’m glad, but I feel like you know it makes for a better conversation, it makes for a better time, it makes for more connection between you know each other, even as we’re on this call. I don’t know, I feel like we need more of those kinds of conversations.

Keya Neal, Guest: You know we need more of those kind of conversations. You know we need more of that. We got to make more room for that, um, make more room for people to be, to be authentic and be okay. Make more room to conversate around the spaces and identifying spaces that don’t want you to be authentic, the spaces where you do have to make so much adjustment. Let’s make them uncomfortable, like well, that’s how I feel. Let me say that.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I agree.

Keya Neal, Guest: I’m like why do I have to walk on eggshells? Why don’t we worry about who’s putting them down there? Who’s putting the eggshells down there?

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yeah, yeah.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Yes, so, Kia, before I let you go, um, if anyone wants to reach out, follow you online, find you, find you online. Where can they go?

Keya Neal, Guest: Absolutely so. You always can find me at Keyaartistically on Instagram across all platforms actually is at Keyaartistically. You can find me at texture vs versus race and you can find me at texture versus racecom. You can find out all about the events that we’re doing, all of the ways you can engage with us. Whether you’re looking for education or not, everything is up there. We’re constantly updating it. We’re going to be launching some educational classes coming up, but our summit is set for May 4th through 6th. I’m hoping that you can make it, hopefully.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Fingers crossed, yes.

Keya Neal, Guest: Fingers crossed for us. Come on now.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Ronan, are you listening?

Keya Neal, Guest: We want? We want to connect and partner with people who can make an impact in the communities, and the community is made up of people who do have diversity and inclusion at the heart and want to have it show from their mind, their hearts and their hands. So I would invite you to come, take a look, check out your content, see what we’re doing, see if we align with what you believe and what you would like to see going forward.

But yeah, I’m easy to find.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: I love it and I’ll have all of those links in the show notes at it for anyone listening who’s looking to, to click through as they’re listening right now.

Keya Neal, Guest: Um click it, let’s go, let’s go.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Well, thank you so much for this. I really, really appreciated the time and had, yeah, such a great time with you. It was very insightful.

Keya Neal, Guest: I had a great time. I can’t wait to see you in person.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Same, absolutely same. When people talk about Key and Neal years from now, what do you hope they say and what do you fear they might say?

Keya Neal, Guest: I hope they say she left it all here. I hope they know that I didn’t take anything with me to the grave. Every thought, every idea, every note, every feeling, every idea, every insight. I hope they know that I’m working really hard to unpack my wagon. I’m going to leave it all here before I go.

What I’m afraid they will say. I don’t think I’m afraid of what they will say, because those that know me know we used to say this old thing that says uh, people that people that matter don’t mind, and people that mind don’t matter, yeah. So I’m not as concerned with what people will say in the negative, but those that really tapped into me will know that I left it all. I left it all on this side of the earth.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Amazing, thank you.

Keya Neal, Guest: Thank you for sharing that.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Thank you.

Keya Neal, Guest: Thank you for having me. This was awesome.

Alex Bélisle-Springer, Host: Really good, I’m glad.